Osciloscop, oscilograme...

[Vizitator]

Adica par asa de prost doar ca am osciloscop analogic cum spunea buzoianul? Am scris de 2 ori ca mi se poare prea pompos termenul pt simpla functie de adunare pe care o face in cazul dezbatut. Adica eu am crezut ca doar atat face functia MATH? Esti pe aceeasi lista cu Marian, nu imi face placere sa comentezi postarile mele decat indirect si in folosul forumului. Eu am niste subiecte de urmarit si un mod personal de a le comenta, nu ma pot schimba la 65 ani. Ca sa intelegi, la sursa semipunte i-am spus lui &DJLOVE ca eu folosesc masurarea semnalului flotant/ comanda mos de sus prin metoda diferentiala cu 2 sonde fiind sigur ca nu are cum sa nu poata fi folosita la oscurile digitale. Atat, eu speram ca orice posesor de digital sa-si cunoasca aparatul si sa determine singur ce comenzi se dau. Pt ca operatie veche de INVERT si ADD putea fi implementata in alt set de comenzi care sa nu includa MATH. In digitala, de fapt in soft sunt atatea modalitati de a implementa o comanda.

Apoi, dupa ce eu am inceput cu un sfat sprijinit pe operarea doar a oscurilor analogice, un baiat destept ca voi acolo trebuia sa intervina in direct si sa-i explice omului cum sa faca si in 2-3 ore aveam oscilogramele si subiectul putea continua altfel. Asa ma rog sa faca unele masuratori, afli dupa 2 zile ca are traf separator, ii spui ca bobina aia nu are ce cauta acolo si el iti raspunde ca de ce a mers la atatia. Habar nu aveti ce consum de energie pt un om bolnav, nu mai am nevoie de lectii pt ca nu vreau sa mai avansez in meserie. Cand am nevoie de ajutor intreb punctual.

[ratza]

V-aţi opărit complet gratuit, atît eu cît şi Marian am subliniat ce face MATH în osciloscoapele digitale. Şi noi tot de două ori am spus că MATH nu e doar funcţie de adunare. Am înţeles de mult că nu mai vreţi să învăţaţi nimic. OK, dar nu le cereţi şi altora acelaşi lucru. E secţiunea de începători, aveţi impresia că cei care n-au pus în viaţa lor mîna pe un osciloscop îi vor şti direct toate funcţiile?

[Vizitator]

Ne invartim in jurul cozii, tocmai ca intuiam ca functia MATH inseamna mult mai multe i-am spus lui Marian ca era suficient sa spuna ca functia de INVERT si ADD este si la digitale si eventual sa-i spuna lui DJLOVE cum sa le acceseze. Pt mine suna ca ma scolea ca pe un copilas, stii, adunarea este la materia matematica. Pe urma vii si tu aiurea sa vad eu sarmanul, cat de inteligent esti (citat): de două ori am spus că MATH nu e doar funcţie de adunare. Oricine de pe pamant poate afla despre MATH in cel mult 2 min, trebuia sa vina marele inginer sa sublinieze o banalitate.

https://www.google.ro/search?sxsrf=ALeKk00wnfMgIh9vapFz3qEgPhgw9ypisQ%3A1583318781172&ei=_YZfXsmGCsWurgSCyI3YCA&q=math+functions+digital+oscilloscope&oq=math+function+digital+oscillos&gs_l=psy-ab.1.0.33i22i29i30.6459074.6474596..6477398...0.0..0.141.3311.12j19......0....1..gws-wiz.......35i39j0i67j0i131j0j0i10j0i203j0i13i30j0i22i30.xC0zbjAMP9w

https://www.testandmeasurementtips.com/basics-math-functions-oscilloscopes/

Nu trebuia nici Marian sa intervina si sa aminteasca de oscul digital deoarece postarea mea avea un singur scop: sa arat celui ce spunea in deradere "doar oscul tau din anii 70... ca o firma mare producea si in 96 osciloscoape avansate (cu memorare digitala) cu aceeasi facilitate de masurare diferentiala cu 2 sonde. 

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EDIT: si pt cei ce nu acceseaza adresele de mai sus:

Virtually every digital storage oscilloscope has math functionality. This
goes beyond the instrument’s ability to measure, quantify and display the
many waveform parameters of a signal at the input, although those
properties are important too.

If you push the Math button while the oscilloscope is operating in the
time domain, you will instantly see these menu items (in a Tektronix
MDO3000 oscilloscope):
• Dual Waveform Math
• FFT
• Advanced Math
• (M) Label
We’ll take them one at a time. Dual Waveform Math, as its name suggests,
requires two signals at the input. To access this fascinating function,
power up the instrument and press Math. The menu appears at the
bottom of the display. Press the soft key associated with Dual Waveform
Math. For one of the two required waveforms, we have connected the
internal AFG, outputting a 60-Hz sine wave with 5-V peak-to-peak
voltage, to analog input channel one. For the other required waveform,
we have connected a 9-V dc battery. The ac waveform is in yellow, the
dedicated color for channel one. The dc waveform is blue, the dedicated
color for channel two. The sum, difference, product and quotient for each
of the operators is in red, which is not one of the dedicated analog input
channel colors. For a tour of this dual waveform math function, using the
soft key that is associated with the operator, cycle through the arithmetic
operators: add, subtract, multiply and divide.
Now, as a further exercise that will demonstrate some other math
relations, reverse the polarity of the battery that is connected to the
probe at the channel two analog input.
Before the dual waveform operation takes place, the first and second
sources are chosen by selecting the desired channels, using multipurpose
knobs a and b. In addition, these same knobs can set one of the available
reference waveforms, R1 – R4 as first and second sources. So it is actually
possible to perform a math operation on a signal or pair of signals that
exist only in the oscilloscope memory.

To see this operation, press the Reference button, which is directly below
the Math button. The Reference Menu appears across the bottom of the
display. It consists of R1 – R4, with the date and time when each
reference waveform was created and, by default, a notation that the
reference signal is off. Pressing the associated soft key with, let us say,
R1; that reference waveform toggles on and appears in the display along
with the other dual waveform signal that has been entered and with the
resultant, each in the dedicated color. (The analog channel inputs are
yellow, blue, purple and green. The math resultant is red. The reference
waveform is white. This color coding makes it easy to see what is going
on.) Notice also that the buttons for Math, Reference, AFG and whatever
analog input channels are active are all lighted. This is in contrast to the
radio frequency button, RF, which when pressed toggles off Math,
Reference and any analog input channels. AFG, however, remains active.
The point is that in the oscilloscope some functions can co-exist while
others are mutually exclusive. Seeing these relationships goes a long way
in understanding the architecture of a digital storage oscilloscope and
then becoming adept at signal acquisition and display.

After Dual Waveform Math, the next item in the Math menu is FFT.
These three innocuous sounding letters stand for fast Fourier transform.
That is a set of algorithms permitting theoreticians, technicians and
others to move from the time domain to a frequency domain view of any
waveform of finite bandwidth. The theoretical basis for this, as stated in
Joseph Fourier’s Analytic Theory of Heat (1822), is that any periodic
function, regardless of its complexity, can be decomposed into the sum of
a finite number of sine waves. It is possible to go back and forth between
these two domains in processes known as analysis and synthesis any
number of times with no loss of information. The advantage of the time
domain representation as seen in an oscilloscope display is that it gives
us a simple intuitive view of a complex waveform, while the frequency
domain view reveals the location within the spectrum and a relative as
well as an absolute measure of the ampacity in power of each constituent
sine function.
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Advanced Math lets users create custom math waveform expressions that
incorporate active and reference waveforms, measurements and numeric
constants. To access the mode, press Math and in the menu, press the
soft key that corresponds to Advanced Math. Then, use the side menu to
create custom expressions. Press Edit Expression and use the
Multipurpose knobs and resulting menu buttons to create an expression.
When done, press OK accept.

For example, Edit Expression can be used to take the integral of a
waveform. To do this, press Clear on the lower menu. Turn Multipurpose
Knob a to select Integrate. Press Enter Selection. Turn Multipurpose
Knob a to select the channel. Press Enter Selection. Select, again using
Multipurpose Knob a. Press OK Accept. The signal is integrated,
calculating the product of amplitude and time, the area under a curved
line generated within Cartesian coordinates.

Editat Martie 4, 2020 de Vizitator

[Marian]

On 3/3/2020 at 2:03 PM, Marian said:

La osciloscoapele digitale ( ca la alea se referea @modoran ) exista functia "math", si in cadrul ei se selecteaza operatia Ch1-Ch2 ( sau invers, functie de cum sunt conectate sondele ).

Prin interventia asta n-am facut decat sa va sustin, deja amintiserati de operatia aia, eu doar am confirmat-o si numit-o in explicit pentru varianta de osciloscoape DSO.

Nu stiu ce v-a determinat sa credeti ca as fi intervenit sa va scolesc pe dvs, pentru numele lui D-zeu n-am osciloscop decat de...nici nu mai stiu cat, dar nu-i foarte mult, si in ciuda faptului ca-l folosesc aproape zilnic in fel si chip, totusi nu sunt in masura sa scolesc pe nimeni in materie de osciloscoape DSO...

Nu stiu nici ce v-a otarat atat in ultima perioada dar vedeti numai agresiuni si atacuri in orice interventie, cand cel putin in cazul meu D-zeu ( si cineva de pe forum ) imi este martor ca va respect si sustin chiar si cand dvs aveti iesirile astea periodice si inexplicabile la adresa mea, eu mereu zic "lasa de la mine", si mereu sper ca o sa va treaca negativismul asta...

La un momentdat insa sa stiti c-o sa-mi pierd rabdarea si implicit indulgenta, atunci va promit ca n-o sa va simtiti deloc bine.

Momentan ma retrag tot eu cu scuzele de rigoare ca v-am plictisit.

 

 

 

[ratza]

Cînd vă calmaţi, îmi trimiteţi un mesaj privat şi redeschid topicul.

Acum 35 minute, miticamy a spus:

Pe urma vii si tu aiurea sa vad eu sarmanul, cat de inteligent esti (citat): de două ori am spus că MATH nu e doar funcţie de adunare. Oricine de pe pamant poate afla despre MATH in cel mult 2 min, trebuia sa vina marele inginer sa sublinieze o banalitate.

 

Editat Martie 4, 2020 de ratza
Adăugat citat.